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Around SBN: Preakness 2012: I'll Have Another Wins Again

A Proposal To Break Territorial-Rights Logjam Between A's And Giants

Jan 11, 2012 - Since just before Christmas, there's been a flutter of rumors suggesting that MLB owners are close to making a decision on whether to permit the Oakland Athletics to move to a new, still-unbuilt ballpark in San Jose, about 40 miles to the south. The owners are meeting in Phoenix this week, and although a decision on the A's ballpark is not officially on the agenda, it's possible the topic will be discussed.

We have a proposal to resolve the key dispute.

USA Today's Bob Nightengale tweeted on December 24 that the A's will be granted permission to move to San Jose by February. Four days later, Susan Slusser, the A's beat writer at the San Francisco Chronicle, contradicted Nightengale's information. Slusser reported that neither the A's nor their cross-town rival San Francisco Giants were aware of any such decision and that, according to former Giants general managing partner Peter Magowan, the Giants would fight any such move as a violation of the team's "territorial rights."

Territorial rights.

It sounds like something from the Age of Empires. No, not the video game. The actual Age of Empires, like the Roman Empire and British Empire.

In a way it is.

Territorial rights describes the way Major League Baseball divides the major metropolitan areas of the United States for its 30 franchises. (Well, 29 franchises in the U.S., plus one in Toronto, Canada). According to research done by baseball researcher and writer Doug Pappas in 2002, Major League Baseball amended its rules between 1990 and 1994 to expand the definition of territorial rights to include not just each team's home city, but also the surrounding counties.

All of the two-team territories but one share the same counties: the Yankees and Mets; the White Sox and Cubs; and the Dodgers and Angels. Only the Giants and A's split the counties surrounding their home cities. The A's territory includes Alameda and Contra Costa counties; the Giants' territory includes San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Cruz, Monterey and Marin counties, "plus Santa Clara County with respect to another major league team." San Jose is in Santa Clara county. To get your bearings, look at this map of California counties.

It is believed that the rule change dividing up the Bay Area counties between the Giants and the A's came about when the Giants made efforts in the early 1990s to build a new stadium in either San Jose or the city of Santa Clara to replace Candlestick Park. Neither team had rights in Santa Clara county. Then-Giants owner Bob Lurie asked then-A's owner Walter Hass to grant those rights to the Giants. Hass, the Commissioner and the other owners agreed.

But the Giants never built a stadium in Santa Clara county, because several voter initiatives to fund such a stadium failed. Instead, Lurie sold the Giants to a Peter Magowan-led group, who in turn privately financed what is now called AT&T Park, in downtown San Francisco. Nevertheless, the MLB rule granting the Giants "Santa Clara County with respect to another major league team" was never amended.

Pappas:

Under rule 1(c), either league can move into a territory belonging to a club in the other league, so long as (3/4 of the affected league's team consent; (b) the two parks are at least five air miles apart unless the two clubs mutually agree otherwise; (c) the newcomer pays the existing club $100,000 plus half of any previous indemnification to invade the territory; and (d) the moves leaves no more than two clubs in the territory. This provision dates to 1960, when it was adopted to establish the terms for the expansion Los Angeles Angels to play in the territory claimed by the Dodgers in 1958.

The $100,000 figure is, obviously, outdated. When the Expos moved from Montreal to Washington, D.C. and became the Nationals, they invaded the Orioles' territory. The O's received $75 million to start a new regional sports network (MASN) and a guaranteed resale price of $365 million.

Which brings us to the A's and the Giants.

Even though the Giants didn't build a stadium in Santa Clara county, they claim to have relied on those territorial rights in financing and building AT&T Park. What does that mean?

In 2009, when the idea of the A's moving to San Jose first surfaced, Giants Senior VP of Communications Staci Slaughter explained: "Obviously, our financing is tied to our sponsorship revenue, our ticket revenue, and we have certain goals we have to hit. And if you have a large share of your sponsors coming from that area, that's a critical part of the equation."

Translation?

The Giants privately financed AT&T Park through debt, corporate sponsorships and charter seat licenses. Charter seat licenses raised $75 million, but that was a one-time fundraising vehicle. Another $50 million came from naming rights with $25 million coming from corporate sponsorships. The original corporate sponsors were a Who's Who of Silicon Valley, which was booming in the late 1990s.

The Giants pay $20 million per year to service the debt, payments which extend through 2017. And they continue to rely on Silicon Valley-based corporate sponsorships to help pay off that debt and defray other budgetary costs -- sponsorships via ads in the ballpark, luxury suites, etc.

How much? We don't know.

What about ticket revenue? The Giants sold more than 3 million tickets during each of the 2010 and 2011 seasons. According to Giants CEO Larry Baer, 3 million tickets sold is the "break even" point for the team. But Baer hasn't explained what that means.

Break even for what? The entire budget? Just player payroll? We don't know.

The Giants claim that Santa Clara and San Mateo counties combined make up "the single largest component of fans and sponsors" and that the Giants' business would be significantly and negatively affected by an A's move to San Jose. Larry Baer said as much during a recent interview on San Francisco public radio station KQED. (Audio file here. Baer's comments start at the 24:10 mark.)

How many fans? How many sponsors? We don't know.

While the answers are unknown, they are knowable. If it's unclear now how much an A's move to San Jose would reduce the Giants' corporate sponsorship and ticket revenue from companies and fans in San Mateo and Santa Clara counties, then MLB owners should put a process in place to find out. And then the orders should require the A's to compensate the Giants for that specific lost revenue through 2017, when the Giants make their last $20 million debt service payment. At this point, a new A's ballpark in San Jose would not likely open until the 2015 season, so the period of time in dispute is limited.

Specifically, the owners should:

  • Grant the A's territorial rights to Santa Clara county; grant the A's and the Giants shared rights to San Mateo, Santa Cruz and Monterey counties; grant the Giants territorial rights to Alameda and Contra Costa counties; and affirm the Giants' territorial rights to San Francisco and Marin counties;
  • Appoint an independent third-party to determine (a) the Giants' current revenue streams derived directly from corporations and fans located in San Mateo and Santa Clara counties; (b) any decrease in the Giants' Santa Clara and San Mateo-based revenue streams in the years leading up to the opening of the A's new ballpark in San Jose; and (c) any (further) decrease in those revenue streams in the time period following the opening of the A's new ballpark up through and including the end of 2017;
  • Direct the A's to pay the Giants 50 percent of Santa Clara and San Mateo-based revenue lost between the date of the owners' vote and the opening of the new ballpark;
  • Direct the A's to pay the Giants 10 percent of the Santa Clara and San Mateo-based revenue lost between the opening of the new ballpark and the end of 2017.

After 2017, each team is on its own.

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Wendy Thurm

Contributor

Wendy wrote most of the prose and poetry in her high school yearbook. Some of it had to do with baseball. She then embarked on a twenty-five year odyssey that had nothing to do with baseball, if you... Read full bio


Comments

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Better idea.

I cannot take credit for this as I stole it from a comment made in something I wrote about this a while back.

The Giants tenaciously hold on to their rights in San Jose for no real good reason. OK, they love SJ so much, let THEM move there.

The A’s can move into the slightly used stadium in San Francisco. Problem solved!

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by Al Yellon on Jan 11, 2012 12:07 PM EST reply actions  

I see no need for a second minor league franchise in San Jose.

2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller

by Johnny Disaster on Jan 11, 2012 1:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Last time I checked, the A’s have 9 World Series Championships (4 in Oakland) and the Giants have 6 (1 in San Francisco). The Giants’ minor league team can have Oakland.

by Craver on Jan 11, 2012 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m not familiar with the Bay Area, but looking at that map, the proposed move doesn’t seem to be very far. Is this really a big deal? Is this really gonna help the A’s?

I mean, moving a few miles south, in what appears to be part of the same metropolitan area doesn’t seem like it’s gonna change the team’s fortunes anything much. It’s more of a cross-town move than anything else. What am I missing?

by Phrozen on Jan 11, 2012 12:15 PM EST reply actions  

They'd be moving into a nicer stadium. The Coliseum really isn't a very nice ballpark.

San Jose is also like, the tenth (?) largest city in the country, and they’d have their stadium right in the middle of it.

You build on failure. You use it as a stepping stone. Close the door on the past. You don't try to forget the mistakes, but you don't dwell on it. You don't let it have any of your energy, or any of your time, or any of your space.
-Johnny Cash

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 11, 2012 12:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Basically, San Jose is the largest city in the metropolitan area, and is only home to one of the big four leagues (the NHL). The populace are sports fans – judging by the Sharks consistently selling out and the plethora of sports apparel I see there – and as of now have to travel at least an hour to see non-hockey sporting events.

Also, San Jose residents may already be A’s fans, but don’t feel like traveling the hour 45 minutes to watch a game in the dump that is the Coliseum. People do travel to San Francisco to see Giants games, though, because with AT&T Park, it’s more of an event than just a game.

And because of its designation as the capital of Silicon Valley (and the central location for most of the big tech companies), there’s a lot more potential corporate support in San Jose rather than Oakland.

Add this to San Jose practically begging for the A’s (they’ve bought the land, done environmental reports, etc. like two years ago), and it becomes a lot more clear why the A’s want to move to the South Bay.

Fear the Fin - NEEDS MORE DOVES

by mymclife on Jan 11, 2012 12:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Well

The reason (or at least, a big reason) people go from the South Bay go to Giants games is Caltrain. There is no good public transportation from South Bay into Oakland (maybe Bart will extend to SJ by the end of our lives, but I’m not holding my breath- and I’m 27). Also, you can drink (read: tailgate) on Caltrain; can’t do that on Bart.

Also, 880 (the main corridor between South Bay and Oakland) is a complete and utter shithole and I avoid that freeway like the plague.

by gpat on Jan 11, 2012 1:05 PM EST up reply actions  

The A's would actually be moving farther away from the Giants than where they currently are situated.

Besides the point, but the move will very much help the A’s in the sense that their current stadium is untenable, Oakland is unable to build a new one with them, and San Jose is a large metropolitan area with the financing and will to make a stadium happen. Don’t let the small physical distance fool you.

Get out the time-fracture wickets, Hobbes! We're gonna play Calvinball!

by UrgentMirth on Jan 11, 2012 12:47 PM EST up reply actions  

San Jose is 40 miles away from Oakland which is on average 1 hour away and can get up to a lot longer if there is traffic. Which there is always traffic in the Bay Area. The freeway that most A’s fans would use to get to San Jose is I880 and that particular stretch of freeway between Oakland and San Jose was rated the 3rd most congested freeway section in CA. Also, the San Jose site is actually further away from AT&T Park than the the A’s current home in Oakland.

by Craver on Jan 11, 2012 1:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Ok, thanks, guys. I’d reply individually, but four of you wrote essentially the same thing.

See, to me, “San Francisco” = “The Bay Area,” and I see them talking about moving one county over, and it’s like, why. Just build a new ballpark. Thanks for explaining how it is.

I know the A’s don’t draw well as is, but aren’t they likely to alienate some of their current fanbase, or will a new stadium outweigh most of that?

by Phrozen on Jan 11, 2012 5:20 PM EST up reply actions  

pretty sure the hope is that the new fans they’d get from the SJ area would out weigh the 8,000 or so that showed up each game when they were in Oakland last year.

They’ve been steadily alienating fans for the last 5 years or so, I don’t see moving as having as much of a difference on things in a negative way to be totally honest.

by Master_Dave on Jan 11, 2012 6:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Brilliant solution

This is exactly what A’s ownership wants and what Giants’ ownership fears. It makes too much sense.

by vertig0 on Jan 11, 2012 12:18 PM EST reply actions  

Expos Move

Since the Expos/Nationals did not move into Baltimore or one of the counties that “touch” Baltimore, why did MLB grant the Orioles $75M and the Nats tv rights?

by comish4lif on Jan 11, 2012 12:20 PM EST reply actions  

The DC area was not covered by Baltimore’s territorial rights, but it was in Baltimore’s defined TV market. The Orioles had no recourse under MLB’s rules to stop a team from moving into their TV market (outside of their territorial rights), but Angelos threatened to sue and MLB threw him some cash to shut him up and expedite the process, as I understand it.

by whitakk on Jan 11, 2012 12:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Population isn't the problem

The A’s problem isn’t the stadium. It is a problem, but it’s not why the attendance in Oakland is where it is.

The A’s problem is that fans can’t trust the team to be there for them year after year. Why root for a team who will trade a 23 year old former 18 game winner who is owed $18M over 3 seasons, but resign a 31 year old outfielder who’s never played in an All-Star game. Not only did Crisp get resigned, but he will make more money in any given season than Cahill would make.

I’m a Giants fan but I’ve been an A’s season ticket holder two separate times. I will not be renewing my tickets for 2012. There is no regard for the fans. The A’s lack stars fans want to see and trade any player with the potential to be a star. The team is little more than a barn for traveling All-Stars to visit and give locals a chance to see their favorite American League players.

We’ve seen small market teams lock up their stars. We’ve seen the books from these supposedly hard luck franchises. Stop drinking the A’s Kool-Aid about the stadium and hold them accountable for providing a shoddy product. Eric Byrnes on KNBR compares the A’s to the Indians of Major league and he’s absolutely right.

by Mario R on Jan 11, 2012 1:01 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Eric Byrnes, you mean the guy that played for the A’s that everyone loved and wanted to give an enormous contract to but got traded away? The same Eric Byrnes that then signed a huge $60 million contract only to turn into a lousy player run out of the league? That Eric Byrnes? Good thing the A’s traded him huh? Matt Holliday and Tim Hudson are really the only players the A’s have let go since Giambi that have prospered (besides CarGo but I don’t count him since he was traded to get Holliday). Swisher has had one great year and the rest have been good power but crappy everything else years. Tejada was crap after he left the A’s, your boy Zito is horrible, and Eric Chavez (the guy they did sign to a long term contract) was absolutely terrible after he signed. Baseball is a business and the A’s office is a dungeon in a town that doesn’t care about them. A move to SJ would allow them to reinvest in the area and the team bringing forth unseen (at least in Oakland) profits.

by Craver on Jan 11, 2012 1:34 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Also, your little link about the books doesn’t even include the A’s so I don’t know why you put that in there. In fact, the A’s reported just arounsd a $1 million loss this last year and that was AFTER RECEIVING $30 MILLION IN REVENUE SHARING!!!

by Craver on Jan 11, 2012 1:38 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I feel like this is the most well-thought out, rational approach to the issue that I have seen regarding this issue, an issue which has seemingly long since turned stale. Solutions for problems like this are never easy, but this seems pretty logical to me.

Too bad Selig and his phantom committee probably napped through it.

"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong

by Solidarity on Jan 11, 2012 1:19 PM EST reply actions  

It's hardly unreasonable for the Giants to claim that a hefty portion of their corporate dollars come from the South Bay.

And it hardly seems fair that they should have to open their books just because Lew Wolff wants the A’s to tank their way out of Oakland.

Also, this seems to require clarification:
This is Haas.

This is Hass.

Easy to confuse, as they’re both green and gold, but it’s the sort of thing in which one should strive for accuracy.

11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi

by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 11, 2012 1:46 PM EST reply actions  

Logjam? What logjam?

A logjam is when both parties have needs unmet by the other. The Giants aren’t asking anything of the A’s. The A’s want something the Giants have and wish to keep, pure and simple. There’s no reason anyone should compel the Giants to give it up.

If the A’s want to move out of Oakland, let them move somewhere else. After all, they are (tied) the most-relocated franchise in Major League Baseball. If they want to stay western, there’s Las Vegas, Portland, Sacramento or San Antonio. North Carolina and Tennessee might also be fertile, and perhaps even Indianapolis. If they think the Oakland Coliseum is not the most profitable AVAILABLE place for them to play, let them pick another that’s not someone else’s. Why should the Giants lose out?

Chaim Mattis Keller New York City's # 1 Royals fan!

by cmkeller on Jan 11, 2012 2:01 PM EST reply actions  

Why should small market teams receive revenue checks?

Obviously, not everyone agrees they should (i.e. the large market teams), but MLB has determined it’s in the best interest of baseball and helps maintain competitive balance.

San Jose is probably the most lucrative market for the A’s to move to and because of it’s proximity to the current fanbase, it is also the least disruptive. Considering the fact that the territory once belonged to the A’s, and was gifted to the Giants to help them with their ballpark dilemma 20 years ago, it only makes sense that the Giants return the favor. If they continue to relent MLB can force them to allow it. That is a power granted to baseball under the MLB constitution.

by gojohn10 on Jan 11, 2012 3:48 PM EST up reply actions  

The Bay Area is big enough for two teams

And thus, Ms. Thurm’s proposal is correct. The Giants WANT the A’s to leave, but there is no good reason for that.

by LWC53 on Jan 11, 2012 3:14 PM EST reply actions  

Loss of revenue

Any loss in revenue the Giants experience from an A’s move south should be partially (mostly?) made up by the Giants gaining fans from the East Bay. It seems that the compensation figure should take into account both the South bay loss and the East bay gain. The A’s or MLB could pay the difference.

by gojohn10 on Jan 11, 2012 3:35 PM EST reply actions  

Great ideas, Wendy!

I think the only thing I would change would be that going forward, I would make the entire Bay Area shared territory just like New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles are. This removes the ‘original sin’ that has got us here in the first place. Otherwise, I think your plan to compensate the Giants for legitimate actual losses is spot on.

In the 1990s, the Giants were done a gentlemanly service by the former owners of the A’s at a time when they were not drawing fans and needed a new facility. The A’s were riding high and did their brothers a huge favour. The Giants gained rights to San Jose as a gift. So this is the spirit in which the Giants should come to the table and negotiate.

Even though the Giants gained rights to the south bay region gratis, they still made business decisions based upon owning these rights. The Giants are entitled to reasonable compensation and they should be reasonable enough to obtain it. This is about money and there’s always a way to mathematically figure out matters of money.

There was a time when the Giants were off to St. Petersburg, FL. I’m sure all of the Giants fans here posting that the A’s should just leave the Bay Area would now be very sad if their own team had done just that. I hope that the Giants are a classy enough organization that would not stoop to trying to drive the A’s out and have the entire region all to themselves.

There are no apostrophes in plurals.
A lot is two words. Allot can be one word but it has another meaning.
The only time you really want to use "myself" is when you are the recipient of your own action. Usually you're better off using "me."
Your is not the correct contraction of you are. The word you're looking for is you're.
It's anyway, not anyways.
But if you only remember one thing...
There are no apostrophes in plurals.

by Since1993 on Jan 11, 2012 6:20 PM EST reply actions  

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