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What's To Be Done With Bill Conlin?

Dec 26, 2011 - In his latest missive, Murray Chass draws a parallel between Ryan Braun's failed drug test and the shocking allegations against legendary Philadelphia sportswriter Bill Conlin.

In the end, Chass does not agree with the arguments that Braun should be stripped of the MVP Award he just won. But Conlin's Spink Award -- the proof of which is displayed in Cooperstown for all to see -- is a trickier matter. Especially for the Hall of Fame, and for the BBWAA. Chass:

Conlin is a different issue and would take much more serious consideration. He is accused of committing an act far more abhorrent than using steroids or testosterone, and the writers should not be in the position of celebrating someone who allegedly is a child molester. But more time and more information are needed to sort out the sordid allegations and allow us to make an informed, intelligent decision. Conlin won’t have a trial, but he will have an opportunity to acquit himself. I’m skeptical, but I’m willing to listen.

As we all should be.

What else is going to happen, though? I mean, aside from more accusations? We've now got seven adults who say Conlin molested them when they were children, in the 1960s and '70s. Some of them told their parents at the time, and their parents haven't forgotten. Even if Conlin's innocent -- which seems exceptionally unlikely -- how would we ever know?

I'm sure that someone will mention that Conlin is "innocent until proven guilty."

In a court of law, yes.

This isn't a court of law. Nor is there likely to be one, ever; the statute of limitations on his alleged crimes has expired.

What we've got is a Court of Public Opinion.

We've also got, or will have at some point soon, a Court of the Baseball Writers' Association of America. And perhaps a Court of the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum, too.

See, the jurisdictions are a bit muddy here. The Hall of Fame itself, though the BBWAA is involved in the selection process, is purely under the purview of (you guessed it) the Hall of Fame itself. The Spink Award is something else entirely. While the winners are highlighted inside the Museum, they are not technically Hall of Famers and the award itself is controlled entirely by the BBWAA.

Essentially, the Hall of Fame and Museum has the power to remove Conlin's lovely photo from their environs, but only the BBWAA has the power to strip the actual award from Conlin.

Should they do it? Or rather, should we do it? I'm still a member in moderately good standing, so I might be asked to cast a vote on this matter at some point in the next few months.

Chass argues that molestation is "far more abhorrent than using steroids or testosterone, and the writers should not be in the position of celebrating someone who allegedly is a child molester."

Perhaps. But what if we discover that one of the players in the actual Hall of Fame did something far more abhorrent than using steroids or testosterone? Say, murder. Would the Hall of Fame seriously consider removing that player? I honestly don't know.

Of course, time plays a role here. Conlin just won the Spink Award. In the display in the Museum, he's featured. If Conlin were dead, or if he'd won the award 10 years ago, this whole sordid affair might be a three-day story. But now? With Conlin still around? With an extra-big photo of him in the Museum? With Jerry Sandusky still running free?

Right now, everything is so raw. If given a chance, I suppose I would split the difference. I would not rescind Conlin's Spink Award, but I would hasten to make him less visible in Cooperstown. We've got a new winner: Bob Elliott. Maybe it's as easy as making him the center piece of the exhibit a few months earlier than scheduled.

Or maybe Conlin should simply be defrocked. I don't have the answer yet. I do anticipate a spirited discussion. Which will be more than welcome.

Poll
Should Bill Conlin be stripped of his Spink Award, and his presence removed from the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum?
Yes
366 votes
No
128 votes

494 votes | Poll has closed

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Rob Neyer

National Baseball Editor

Rob Neyer began his career with legendary baseball author Bill James, and later worked for STATS, Inc. and ESPN.com, writing more words for that website than anyone else. Rob has written or... Read full bio


Comments

Display:

Here's another way to look at it.

Let’s say these allegations had come out a year ago, before the voting for the 2011 Spink Award.

Would Conlin have been voted the award by the BBWAA under those circumstances? I think not. As you note, he’s currently “featured” at the Hall of Fame.

The speech he gave at the Hall last summer is done. It cannot be undone. But I do not think you and the other BBWAA voters would have given him this honor if you had known about these decades-old events before the voting.

It would seem to me that this honor is a slap in the face of those who were allegedly abused.

As I was writing this comment, I went back and forth like you apparently did, Rob. It’s not a black & white issue, but as of now, I’d lean toward taking this honor away.

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by Al Yellon on Dec 26, 2011 8:26 AM EST reply actions  

I've never really understood

why a mans personal life has anything to do with his professional life. If someone dug up dirt implicating Babe Ruth in a child molestation ring, would you want to strip him of his Hall of Fame plaque and candy bars? I would hope not, because it’s irrelevant.

What a man does in his personal life is really no business of anyone (unless he breaks the law). It certainly shouldn’t impact any honors he receives in his professional life.

by JaySchu on Dec 26, 2011 8:39 AM EST reply actions  

I'd suggest a more careful read of the post

What Conlin (allegedly) did is against the law. It just happened long enough ago that he cannot be prosecuted and convicted/acquitted in a court of law. (As Rob notes.)

Rob also notes

If Conlin were dead, or if he’d won the award 10 years ago, this whole sordid affair might be a three-day story.

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by jbg2772 on Dec 26, 2011 9:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Right.

And further… let’s say these things had come to light 35 or 40 years ago, when they were alleged to have happened, and Conlin had been convicted of doing them.

If that had occurred, Conlin would not have had those decades of sportswriting that eventually led to him being granted the award.

Food for thought.

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by Al Yellon on Dec 26, 2011 10:33 AM EST up reply actions  

"(unless he breaks the law)"

That’s a pretty big and meaningful caveat. Even though he won’t be tried because the statute of limitations expired, is there really any doubt that Conlin broke the law in the most repugnant way imaginable? Does anyone really believe that seven people (one of them being a prosecutor) made this whole thing up?

by ken on Dec 26, 2011 1:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Personal life is an official HOF criteria

Actually, personal life is officially relevant to induction to the HOF. The question here is really whether the standard should be applied after the fact for something done before the voting.

From their site: “Voting shall be based upon the player’s record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) on which the player played.”

The HOF factors don’t say “Character shall only be considered if it results in a conviction.” It doesn’t even say “crime”.

That said, just because the statute of limitations has run doesn’t mean a crime hasn’t been committed. Child molestation is a crime. (Please take a quiet moment with yourself regarding whether you think child molestation should be considered a crime or a personal foible that is nobody’s business.)

by Mirror on Dec 27, 2011 1:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Did anyone try to cart O.J.'s gear out of Canton right after he was indicted for murder?

Even after he lost that civil case to the Goldman family, and after all his more recent legal problems, he’s still in the football Hall.

Your suggestions make sense: Don’t retract Conlin’s award, but change the current display at Cooperstown.

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by ernaga on Dec 26, 2011 9:30 AM EST reply actions  

Suddenly

the BBWAA cares about ethics?

That said (as always): Man, we gotta be REALLY careful in these weird times. I read a column over the weekend that brought up the spector of the satanic day-care frenzy of the … 1980s and ‘90s, I think it was, when children were being persuaded to conjure up memories of black masses and ritual rape and sacrifice in the back room. And if they didn’t remember any such thing, then they must be repressing those memories!

Wiki even has an entry, titled “Day care sex abuse hysteria”:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-care_sex-abuse_hysteria

You can call a man most anything these days — cheat, liar, thief, animal abuser — and his life and career (Michael Vick) can recover from it. But you call a man a child molester and his life is O-V-E-R. He’s not even safe in prison.

Conlin says he didn’t do it, says he’s a victim of an old family vendetta. It doesn’t help his case much that one of his accusers is now a prosecutor, and that lends legitimacy to the accusations, but still: If the man is not going to get a chance to tell his side of the story under oath, how can we automatically take the other side against him?

Tough call. I would, as always, simply advocate that the BBWAA cut its ties to all award-voting and the Hall of Fame, so that it can forever avoid complications like this.

by bucdaddy on Dec 26, 2011 11:05 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

I would, as always, simply advocate that the BBWAA cut its ties to all award-voting and the Hall of Fame, so that it can forever avoid complications like this.

Even if this did occur, that wouldn’t change the issue in this case — if some other body had voted this award, the same calls for taking it away would be made.

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by Al Yellon on Dec 26, 2011 12:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Al,

You’re either missing or ignoring the point.

If someone else does the voting, fine, journalists are still free to praise or eviscerate the voting decisions, but they are not then a) becoming the story themselves, seen in many old-school journalism circles as a no-no; b) deciding whose bank account benefits and whose doesn’t, which IMO is ethically questionable; and c) forced to confront issues like this and Ryan Braun when they mess all over themselves (and by “they” I mean Conlin, Braun AND the BBWAA).

I see nothing -zero - to gain for journalists to be involved in voting for awards (and, thus, the transfer of tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars) and all their credibility to lose. Unless the BBWAA just doesn’t give a shit about credibility.

Let me just ask you point blank: Do you believe it’s ethical for working journalists to decide who cashes in an MVP clause, or who goes into the Hall of Fame and benefits financially from having a plaque in Cooperstown? Where in the definition of “working journalist” is that written?

by bucdaddy on Dec 27, 2011 1:19 AM EST up reply actions  

I didn't miss your point at all

… and I agree with it.

My point was that the issue would be the same regarding Conlin no matter who was doing the voting.

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by Al Yellon on Dec 27, 2011 8:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Coercing children to testify under pressure....

….is hardly the same as adults discussing what happened to them in their childhood years. If this was one accuser, I’d be suspicious. But it’s 7. Including a relative. The comparison to the McMartin case is not an apt one here. Comparison to the very real cases of children abused by religious authorities would be much more apropos.

Conlin might not have a “court of law” to respond in, but I’m sure he would have a very willing audience through any variety of media to listen to him tell his side of the story and refute what has been said about him instead of offering blanket denials through a lawyer. Lawyering up is understandable when criminal charges might be in the offing. But since the statute of limitations is over, Conlin’s relative silence in this matter does not seem to benefit him in any way. Yes, we are only getting one side of the story – but it’s not the story of a bunch of children being manipulated by an out-of-control prosecutor. It’s the stories of grown people whose lives were allegedly shattered by a very damaged person.

NEITHER side is “under oath.” But that doesn’t mean that they are restricted from speaking their version of the truth. If Conlin comes forward and explains these charges and demonstrates how they are false, I’ll be more than willing to believe him. But common sense and experience says that when seven grown people accuse you of doing something that ruined their lives – one of them being a legal professional and a relative who knows the damage being done – then you’d better come out with a helluva response, and not simply “retire” from you job, shout “lies” and disappear.

by jdscott on Dec 27, 2011 1:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Civil case?

Does anyone know if the statute of limitations applies to a civil case, as well? Could the victims bring a civil suit against Conlin, in which case testimony could be presented against, and in defense of, him?

by GBSimons on Dec 26, 2011 3:24 PM EST reply actions  

It's a grey area

Technically the statute of limitations has expired for a civil case, but lawyers have argued around that in the past specifically as it pertains to child molestation. However, the accusers all say that they’re not interested in money, but more so are interested in others knowing who he is and perhaps emboldening someone who he has abused within the statute of limitations to come forward. While that may seem like a cry for 15 minutes of fame, what most children—who eventually become adults—want most when speaking about their molestation is for someone to believe them. For the individuals who Conlin molested coming forward, even at their age, no doubt this is very cathartic and healing for them. In many ways child molestation is a worse crime than murder, because while murder takes a life, child molestation tortures people psychologically for the rest of their lives if they don’t get help.

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by Pig.Pen on Dec 27, 2011 2:53 PM EST up reply actions  

This is really tricky to say

I mean, on the one hand, it seems very likely that he molested seven children (now adults) and has just been given an award, and it looks incredibly bad. On the other hand, do we want to set that precedence? I mean, I think it’s Ty Cobb has been accused of killing a man. Should we take away his plaque? No, and I don’t think anyone has even thought about that. How do we know where to draw the line?

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by imstillhungry95 on Dec 27, 2011 12:06 AM EST reply actions  

I get the Ty Cobb argument

But my feeling here is that Conlin is a writer, it’s nice that they elect the writers into the HOF, but do you—or anyone else—really care if they go to the HOF and Bill Conlin isn’t there? For the writers it’s more about the award than it is about the HOF being a museum and including them in it.

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by Pig.Pen on Dec 27, 2011 2:55 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't really care

if he’s there or not, but if we take it away from him, in fairness we should start taking it away from everyone who has committed heinous crimes, Ty Cobb being one of them

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by imstillhungry95 on Dec 27, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Unringing the bell...

“…Ty Cobb has been accused of killing a man”??? You THINK? Do you think you might want to get your facts straight before you allege in print that you THINK someone may have killed someone else? Ty Cobb is often portrayed as a vicious, angry brawler and racist, but a killer? it was his MOTHER, not he, who killed a man; she defended her actions by saying that she believed the man she killed (Cobb’s father) was an intruder breaking into the house. I find it interesting and ironic that a commenter would raise such a point based on a complete misunderstanding of the known facts in order to defend someone who may or may not be guilty of the crimes of which he stands accused.

So Bill Conlin is being painted as a sexual predator by the victims he allegedly preyed upon decades ago. His reaction – insulting those accusers in an effort to portray them as unstable and unreliable, rather than directly refuting their charges – is typical of predators who have been exposed by the survivors of their predations. One accusation might leave some room for doubt, but seven? You’d have to believe that Conlin was himself the victim of a large and far-reaching conspiracy to discount the veracity of those seven claims – and that’s just the number so far. As with Jerry Sandusky’s ever-increasing cadre of accusers, those seven are probably the tip of the iceberg, because predators who use their status within a social or professional hierarchy to shield their depraved acts from any meaningful scrutiny have probably been committing their crimes with a fair degree of impunity for a long, long time.

Conlin is NOT a “Hall of Famer”; the bestowing of the Hall’s Spink Award upon him does not render him an inducted member of the Hall of Fame. Ty Cobb is a “Hall of Famer;” Conlin is merely a winner of an award for sports journalism. As such, I cannot even fathom that the Hall would countenance any further celebration or acknowledgment of his so-called achievement, and his image should be deleted from any exhibit or display there. And anyone who believes that a person’s private acts have nothing to do with his or her professional qualifications and accomplishments is living in a dream world. You can’t separate a person’s public and private acts; people are not the church and state, we are whole, integrated beings, and what each of us does when the lights and cameras are turned off is often far more revelatory of our true natures than what we do when we know someone else is watching. Conlin has been exposed for what he is, finally, and now he’s trying to wiggle out of his nasty predicament and downplay the seriousness of the charges against him by invoking some pretty standard tactics and canards. If the court of public opinion is all there is left to convict him, he’ll soon be getting an entirely justified “life sentence,” at least from me.

by umpireplb on Dec 27, 2011 8:42 AM EST reply actions  

Get YOUR Facts Straight

Did you take them straight from Wikipedia?

The rumors of Ty Cobb having murdered a man (though untrue if the first few internet searches I did are to be trusted) are completely unrelated to his mother killing his father. I don’t pretend to be familiar with the details, but the discussions about Cobb and murder have to do with whether he killed a man who tried to rob him in 1912.

And continuing on the theme, it’s not “the Hall’s Spink Award.” Its’ the BBWAA’s Spink Award. The Hall happens to display the winners.

Myself, I don’t think he should be stripped of the award. He won it. He didn’t win it for being a good person, he won it for being a good baseball writer (which he is not, but that’s a different issue). The solution of not displaying anything about him in the Hall other than his name on a list of the winners seems like the right one to me.

by moviegoer74 on Dec 27, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

a rumor is not a fact...

Absolutely correct, moviegoer74; this site offers no grace period for editing or correcting once a post is entered, so thank you for clarifying my error in attributing the bestowal of the Spink Award to the Hall of Fame rather than the Baseball Writers Association. The award is given during the Induction Day weekend ceremonies (separately now, on a different day than the actual induction ceremonies so as to distinguish the award winners from the inductees,) but other than that it has no connection to the Hall.

Concerning your insistence that Ty Cobb is “rumored” to have killed a man: I made a very clear distinction between “fact” and “rumor” in my post, and your (and imstillhungry95’s) repetition of a rumor as if it were fact simply because it’s the subject of conjecture on Wikipedia is unfair and unnecessary defamation. Ty Cobb can be rightfully criticized, even vilified, for what he is actually known to have done without wrongfully invoking some unsubstantiated rumor just to make him look worse than he actually was. “…Discussions about Cobb and murder have to do with whether he killed a man who tried to rob him in 1912” are not clear and convincing evidence of his being a murderer; it’s simply your personal speculation about the case and the rumors around it. His mother killed his father, that is a fact. Ty Cobb might have killed a man? That’s merely a guess, an assumption, and to posit it as your opinion is fine; but cloaking it in the garb of infallible fact and using it to smear someone who may very well be innocent of the charges with which you admit you’re not even familiar is heinous.

by umpireplb on Jan 3, 2012 10:23 AM EST up reply actions  

Here's an idea, make Conlin's display bigger!

I think the Hall of Fame should have a big display dedicated to Conlin and in it they should mention the alleged claims so that everyone who enters will know that Bill Conlin is a child molester. If they have the information available, I would even include his address, home phone number and email.

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by Pig.Pen on Dec 27, 2011 2:58 PM EST reply actions  

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